IW 121: Interview Alex Laferriere Part 1: Sign Language for Humanity-Rip the Band-Aid OFF

It'll hurt! But it won't heal if it's covered. So, pull and pull fast!
Are sign language interpreters just a "bandaid" for systemic societal issues?

Some wounds are deep and hard to heal. Covering up problems without analyzing what's the root of the problem can cause more problems. Our guest today, Alex, a child of deaf adults is not a sign language interpreter. His stories teach us a new perspective of the CODA journey and can help us understand our relationship with the communities we serve.

As talked about in episode IW 123, here is Alex's ASL signing on his YouTube gaming episode: https://youtu.be/TA3qC98jm9o?si=gkFb5rHzHUZrRG0J&t=1533

LINKS mentioned:

• IW Community Discount until Dec 31, 11:59:59pm.
  • 10-50% OFF workshops, seminars. Earn CEUs, CPD, and professional development hours.
  • And much more.
• Sharon's new book! (Use promo code IWCurry for 10% Discount.)
  • Give a note to ask for a signed copy!

Transcript

IW 121: Interview Alex Laferriere Part 1: Sign Language for Humanity-Rip the Band-Aid OFF

Support the Podcast!

[ROCK INTRO MUSIC STARTS]

00:00:02 Tim

Good morning, good evening, good afternoon. Wherever you are, this is the Interpreter's Workshop podcast. I'm Tim Curry, your host. Here we talk everything sign language interpreting the ins, the outs, the ups, the downs, the sideways of interpreting. If you're a student, a new interpreter, experienced interpreter, this is the place for you. If you want to know more, go to interpretersworkshop.com.

00:00:28 Tim

Let's start talking... interpreting.

[ROCK INTRO MUSIC ENDS]

00:00:34 Tim

And now the quote of the day by T. D. Jakes, American Christian preacher.

00:00:42 Tim

“My mother would take the Band-Aid off, clean the wound and say, ‘Things that are covered don't heal.’ Well, mother was right. Things that are covered do not heal well.”

00:00:57 Tim

Today's guest will talk a little bit about how we need to fix the problem rather than covering it with a Band-Aid. What is the Band-Aid, sign language interpreters. Today we speak with a CODA, who is not a sign language interpreter.

00:01:18 Tim

We learn about his journey becoming and understanding what it means to be a CODA. His experience will inform us deeper about part of the communities that we serve and their relationships with one another and with us.

00:01:37 Tim

So, let's delve into the perspective of our guest today. Let's get started.

[SHORT TRANSITION MUSIC]

00:01:48 Tim

My guest today is Alex Laferriere from the US. Born as the middle child of three to deaf parents and a large deaf family on his dad's side, Alex has taken this entertainer's birth position and utilized it in the process of making media in all forms, visual to audio, to image, and much more. He's made films, podcasts, policy briefs, games, all showcasing his eclectic range of interests and capabilities. Today, we hope to dig into all of this experience and learn about him, his background, how it has impacted his work, and how it can influence us as sign language interpreters. So, welcome Alex to the podcast.

00:02:34 Alex

Thanks. I'm happy to be here.

00:02:36 Tim

So, let's open the doors wide open and start with your identity as a CODA. When and how do you remember that moment when my family's different?

00:02:49 Alex

Mm-hmm.

00:02:50 Alex

Ahh… OK. So, to identify when I learned about the notion of CODA actually happened later in my life, way later post College in fact. And, I go to a very specific story. But as far as my family being different…

00:03:07 Alex

I guess even early in childhood, you know, I was sort of identified as the kid who could go up on stage and tell us how to sign “Rain, rain, go away” or, you know, “He's got, he's got the whole world in his hands” as a very specific memory as well, too. So, I, I guess I've always noticed that. And I've been told stories later on, about my thoughts to my parents…

00:03:28 Alex

“Oh, I wish we would do this. We can't do that.” Or, OK. I don't recall them directly, but I guess I've always noticed it from the start, [Tim: mm-hmm] but I didn't really think anything of it, especially identifying the aspect of CODAness. And if that had any significance at all.

00:03:44 Alex

And it goes back to that story, post college in which I was working at a, a wonderful coffee shop slinging lattes at Starbucks. [Tim: YAY!] Yeah, and someone came in late towards the end of the shift.

00:04:00 Alex

And she ordered four espressos. And I was like, “Wow, what are you doing at 5:00? Yeah, with four espressos.” “Well, I'm a... I'm a sign language interpreter.” And I was like, “Oh, that's cool. That's nice. Yeah. I, I, I know sign language, too.” And she's like, “Oh, yeah.” You know, kind of like, skeptical. And so, I, you know, started sig... I started signing with her. “Hey, you know how you doi… Nice to see… what you doing today.” You know, “What are you doing after…” Whatever…

00:04:22 Alex

Just had a conversation and she was kind of like, her eyes kind of like shook for a second. And was like, “Well, well,” like, “you're pretty good.” And I was like, “Yeah, OK, I guess, like, my, my parents are Deaf.” I just casually kind of passed by that notion. And her… she stopped and…

00:04:35 Alex

Her eyes just lit up and was like, “You're a CODA.” [Tim chuckling]

00:04:39 Alex

You have to understand that at this point in my life, I was completely… I don’t wanna say down on my luck. But this is a 2008-9 economic crash. I'm working at Starbucks with a college degree [Tim: mm-hmm] trying to be a filmmaker and this, this aspect. So, I, I was kind of at a loss for a lot of different things and it's also in contrast to my former hearing life in high school. [Tim: mm-hmm]

00:04:59 Alex

And having a different relationship with a redheaded girl that was a wonderful person. But to have this sort of influence in my life in this way and to kind of be looked at as this thing that I didn't even know that I was. [Tim: mm-hmm] And to be kind of like, “Ohh you, you have this aspect.”

00:05:14 Alex

And she brought this notion of CODA to my life, and it was at this sort of pivotal point where I was like, “What?!” And it started my long journey. So that's a long-winded tale of, of identifying my CODAness. And we could get more into that if you'd like.

00:05:26 Tim

Yeah. What? What did you say to her? I'm, I'm assuming you didn't even know what the word meant. CODA.

00:05:31 Alex

Right! Exactly. Yeah. Oh, you're a child of deaf adult. You, you, you…

00:05:36 Alex

Were raised in the Deaf community. [Tim: Yeah] You had, you had, and, and…

00:05:40 Alex

She didn't even know about my extended family on my Dad’s side so….

00:05:43 Alex

She, you know, “tell me more about this”, you know, like, “I'm going to this interpreter thing. But like, are you gonna be here tomorrow?” type of thing. Like, “can we come and talk more about this?” And I was like, [Tim: yeah] “Yeah, I guess so. Sure. [Tim laughing] Like it's usually, it's usually a lull at these times or whatever and like, yeah, let's, let's just you know the, the Starbucks is a place where people chat so, sure.”

00:06:00 Alex

And I had… deaf customers would come in every now and then and they always love coming in because I could interpret or like I could, you know, communicate with them directly and get their orders done. And it was always just like, alright, cool. [Tim: mm-hmm] But I never really thought much about it until this one specific instance. And she started to come in and…

00:06:16 Alex

“Ohh, you were brought up in the deaf community.” “Yeah, I guess so. I went to deaf timber fests [Tim chuckling] and you know all these aspects where… Yeah, there's tons of, tons of, you know, deaf involvement cause my, my father and, and family were sort of involved with various deaf activities, but, So what?!” And, “No, no. Like you had the language from the birth and you're you use it all the time in your household.”

00:06:37 Alex

And it started making me think about the, the language dynamics in my family [Tim: mm-hmm] and, and American Sign Language specifically, and never really had any exposure to deaf culture, deaf history, deaf background and sort of had it kind of come in the super, hyper concentrated form at a point in my life in which I didn't know where I was going or what I was doing. And I, you know, slinging lattes with a college degree is like, this is the culmination of my educational background and sort of this gave me an extreme focus that no one in my background educationally has really pointed out to me and to have it be revered in this way, I was like…

00:07:11 Alex

“I should probably look more into this.” [Tim: Yeah] And it keeps going from there, so.

00:07:15 Tim

Yeah, OK. I'm gonna veer off topic here.

00:07:18 Alex

Go for it.

00:07:19 Tim

What is deaf Timberfest? What is that? [both laughing]

00:07:23 Alex

Yeah, I guess it's a very New England thing here in the US it's a gathering of…

00:07:27 Alex

It's like, basically camping, and it's sort of a, a lumberjack, umm… You know, wood cutting competitions and various activities within the forests of maybe Maine, New Hampshire, Vermont of some sorts. [Tim: uh-huh] And maybe there's 100 Deaf couples, family, folks that come together and do axe throwing competitions and log-cutting competitions.

00:07:49 Alex

And I think it was maybe like, yeah, three or four days over a long weekend, maybe it's every over this Labor Day weekend that we just had [Tim: Wow] sort of an activity. Yeah. And I, I probably went to one of those every year, if not every other year. I remember deaf Timberfest being a very specific gathering of sorts. And then there's just.

00:08:04 Alex

And then there’s just the general going to vacations with my, my family extended family, aunts and uncles who were all adults, deaf signers. And that's key as well too, because having this relationship appear in my life allowed me an access to a younger signing group. [Tim: mmm]

00:08:22 Alex

And this, the, the story continues of, you know, after this woman, whatever, left my little Starbucks place of employment, I started looking for other younger deaf signers, male, female, whatever. Like it didn't matter. It was just an aspect of [Tim: mm-hmm] I want more of this, but not in a like elderly my, my older adults in my life. [Tim: yeah] You know, how was school? You know that sort of dynamic and relationship. No, it was, let's talk about movies. Let's talk about, you know, video games. Let's talk about whatever… IN SIGN.

00:08:50 Alex

And that, and I, you know, despite her, you know, appreciation of my sign language at that time I was not an adept signer, in my opinion. Because I, I, I wouldn't say SimCom a lot, but it was very sloppy in terms of my execution and, and we can get more into that as we talk about it as well. [Tim: yeah]

[SHORT TRANSITION MUSIC]

00:09:09 Tim

So up until that point, this is 2008, after college, you were an adult. If we can call ourselves adult, right after college.

00:09:18 Alex

Hmm. Yeah, 2010 to be specific at post college.

00:09:21 Tim

Oh, OK. So, had you encountered interpreters before?

00:09:25 Alex

In various capacities and limited capacities, I think one of the… Yeah, I remember very specifically my older brother's high school graduation, in high school in our hometown, and we had interpreters at the high school graduation. And I remember sitting up front and seeing these interpreters and just, you know, graduation time. And I remember very specifically…

00:09:43 Alex

…being like, “Thank goodness, there's an interpreter here”, like just... And I was younger, probably teens-ish or something [Tim: mm-hmm] and just be like, “Oh, good thing there's an interpreter here.” And that was about it. And then, you know, like, I never really thought professionally about it. And then there was the occasional one-off interpreter at our hearing church at the time that would have an interpreter show up every now and then. And “Oh, cool interpreter.” [Tim: mm-hmm]

00:10:03 Alex

But it was very much in my immediate family that sign language existed, [Tim: mm-hmm] and I guess as a kid you never appreciate your own family existence. So, it wasn't until later on where I went out in my own journey that I started to appreciate and meet more interpreters and very specifically engage them on that interpreter level, but… [Tim: yeah]

00:10:21 Alex

…by no means do I consider myself an interpreter professionally.

00:10:24 Tim

Right. But talking with many CODA interpreters, they all tell me, you know, they've been interpreting since they can remember. [Alex: mm-hmm] Just incidentally, you might say throughout their life, were you doing the same thing or… [Alex: yes] Was it your siblings?

00:10:38 Alex

No, I, I, I'm probably the “go-to-interpreter” as well too.

00:10:43 Alex

We all interpreted in some way, shape or form, but I of course had interpreting instances too. [Tim: yeah]

00:10:47 Alex

And I remember very specific stories, you know, huge blow ups at mechanics’ shops and so on and so forth. And… “Clearly, he's upset” and sort of my, my response like and stuff like that. [both laughing]

00:10:59 Alex

But I, I do acknowledge having gone on my CODA journey and having deaf culture really rise into the mainstream, that it hasn't been as demanding or extreme as a lot of the history of the CODA experience has been, [Tim: hmm] whether exemplified in the mainstream movie, or you know by our elders in the community talking pre-ADA [Americans with Disabilities Act (law)] pre-TTY, pre-telephone.

00:11:20 Alex

So, oh wow, you know, to kind of put it in that sense. Like, I think my, my parents were very capable, and connected to technology and that has, that has changed the dynamic.

00:11:29 Tim

Yeah. Do you think that's influenced you in your focus on technology and filming and so forth?

00:11:37 Alex

Absolutely. My dad was a big proponent of computers in the house at such an early age. We had one of those….

00:11:44 Alex

…those, umm the Mac, the, the Macintosh computers, [Tim: uh-hu, yeah] the, the little ones are, you know. I was probably 6, 7, 8 and I think when he got it second hand from a college student in the mid-90s. And that was our first experience. And my dad's such a, a dork when it comes to technology. [Tim lightly chuckles] And we've always had, you know, newer computers in our household, [Tim: great] despite whatever our economic standing and all that sort of stuff.

00:12:03 Alex

But it's been a huge component to…

00:12:05 Alex

Oh yes, having this stuff and playing with it as a kid, which has led me down to being self-taught or being a tech savvy in my own way, [Tim: mm-hmm] and that has proliferated from there in our society.

[ROCK TRANSITION MUSIC STARTS]

00:12:16 Tim

Are you tech savvy? Well, this part’s easy. Just go to the show notes, click on Support the Show, or Buy Me A Coffee to help support the show. And keep the passion alive. Thank you. Now let's go back.

[ROCK TRANSITION MUSIC ENDS]

00:12:32 Tim

So, you've never really been one of those annoying CODAs that correct interpreters when they're with your parents, or you just haven't had that experience?

00:12:43 Alex

No, I don't think so. Yeah, because every, every interpreter has been professional and standing in on their own two feet as wonderful people. I, I think even now in my later age I would rather let it be. Obviously if it's a life-or-death situation, let's step in and, and do our best. [Tim: mm-hmm] But it's… everyone's learning here, and I've also learned there needs to be different relationships between different folks and to try to step in and, and correct everything is disturbing to whatever client and professional or whatever the terms might be. [Tim: mm-hmm]

00:13:14 Alex

And also turn the burden back on to myself to be the person that should always be there to correct things, and the system needs to correct itself.

00:13:23 Tim

It's kind of like, although I may be tech savvy with the computer, I would not be able to tell a programmer what's wrong with it, [Alex: mm-hmm, mm-hmm] and yet that would be annoying. I think for them for me to give all these suggestions.

00:13:38 Alex

Absolutely. And the big one in, umm, recent memory is going to a hospital and being like, can you interpret for your in-laws or whatever? And my, my family, they never can get into… [Tim: Wow] “Yeah, sure.” And it's like, wow, even this day and age and post my masters education and better enlightened am I like uh here are these instances that they appear. But ah no, I am wise enough to say, “No. I would prefer to use the in-person one, you don't have that?”

00:14:02 Alex

“What's your next option? VRI. OK, let's do the video relay interpreter and all of its pluses and minuses.” Obviously, it's not even up to me. “Ask. Ask them. Ask him them, her, or she, the client. Whatever.” [Tim: Yeah] 

00:14:13 Alex

And whatever they prefer… but I am here if worse comes to worse. But even if the even if the system were to fail, I guess we're gonna have to have another appointment because the system needs to recognize that there's a problem here [Tim: mm-hmm] rather than falling through the cracks in the data. “Oh, we had a patient come in and it was perfect and fine.” It doesn't detail. And the person that brought them here brought them in and solved the problem. No, I want….

00:14:34 Alex

And I'm also big on billable hours and recognizing all this sort of stuff that the system needs to actually keep track of, otherwise it will never get fixed or get accounted for or prove that it's in use.

00:14:45 Tim

Yeah, plus your, your family, and you should not have that extra burden in, in such a moment. [Alex: mm-hmm]

00:14:51 Alex

Yeah, unless it's a life-or-death situation. [Tim: right] And then obviously step in and clarify and, and I've been on both sides of…

00:14:58 Alex

“You don't… No in person, no VRI. And you're, you're sitting here writing with them… what, what? I don't have all day. Let's just I'll, I’m gonna start interpreting and let's get through this because this is supposed to end two hours ago and we're still going.” [Tim: mm-hmm]

00:15:09 Tim

Yeah. It's sad in this day and age in the US that has laws [Alex: mm-hmm] to prevent this, it still happens. It's sad. [Alex: mm-hmm]

00:15:21 Tim

So why didn't you pursue a career as an interpreter?

00:15:26 Alex

Yeah, I didn't pursue a career as an interpreter because I never really saw an avenue for it. It was always sort of mentioned to me second handedly both hearing and deaf people. [Tim: mm-hmm] You can make good money as an interpreter. Yeah. OK. So what? Like it's money. It's way more than just money.

00:15:43 Alex

It's really getting involved. And I think a lot of my exposure to it…

00:15:47 Alex

…has always been a eye-rolling like…

00:15:51 Alex

I don’t wanna do this. Like or like Arrgggh. Like there's, there's never been a fun moment of, of trying to interpret between the two worlds. [Tim: mm-hmm] It hasn't been, you know, there… I'm sure there's joyous moments and stuff as well too, but we always hold on to the, the heavy-handed stuff and it's like you're telling me my job is gonna be filled with these instances day in, day out. It's a very naive perspective and.

00:16:09 Alex

It’s a very naïve perspective and probably very adolescent as well too from a…

00:16:13 Alex

…like a person who's just about to graduate high school. And then you get caught up in hearing world stuff and I go to my hearing world college cause there's a there's a CODA of college and, and, and as I, as I call them and all this that would change my perspective on it all.

00:16:27 Alex

But leave it to the professionals, I guess, and, and, and. No, no, no shade or anything on the interpreting profession. [Tim: mm-hmm]

00:16:33 Alex

I just feel that there's a, larger things that need to be corrected or, or, or, or fixed. And I feel like sometimes the interpreting is just a Band-Aid to the overall societal systemic issues, but I'm sort of a “go big or go home” type of guy and maybe that's not really focusing in on the immediate problems in the forefront that are right in front of me so…

[SHORT TRANSITION MUSIC]

00:17:00 Tim

What do you see as being able to “rip this Band-Aid off” and get rid of the interpreters? [Alex: mm-hmm] How could we fix that.

00:17:08 Alex

Sign language for humanity! Elevating the aspect of sign language, you know, looking at historical examples of Martha's Vineyard as a utopian example in which sign language and spoken language lived coterminously, and we all could sign. And, and it's like, these are the larger things that I think about.

00:17:26 Alex

And one-on-one interpreting at, you know, the grocery or whatever is like, is awesome. But like, where is, where is this all going towards other than the, the little Dutch boy, you know, poking holes in the levee and I'd rather just bust open the levee and rebuild the whole thing or, or, you know, whatever metaphor you want to run with. [Tim chuckling]

00:17:46 Tim

Well, yeah, that's not just the big picture. That's the universal picture. Wow. [Alex chuckles]

00:17:50 Alex

That's my plight, I guess [Tim laughing] recently in terms of media, and you know that's why I look to these mainstream movies and stuff to get back to my media stuff because…

00:17:57 Alex

It's changing the mindset of sign language [Tim: mm-hmm] and, and deaf culture and OK, great. Where's that…? Where's the, where's the trajectory going to take us? And obviously everyone has a hand in that, too. Sign language interpreters, deaf clients, these strange CODAs in between, everyone is a sign language user and, and that is the heart of what I want to engage with. But obviously we have different camps and different alliances and different factions, and different goals. So…

00:18:21 Alex

We're all kind of caught in that and I don't know. I think once you align yourself with one political faction not politically in terms of Democratic or Republican, but politically in terms of like, I believe in this, or I believe in that in Deaf culture stuff you, ugh, you start to get “camp-ified” or, [Tim: yeah] or, or the perspective is, is bent.

00:18:40 Tim

Yeah. And then we have to think about the fact that it's not just one sign language, there's, you know, hundreds.

00:18:46 Alex

Mm-hmm.

00:18:47 Alex

Yeah, I didn't say ASL for humanity, I said Sign Language for Humanity. [laughs]

00:18:51 Tim

Yes, exactly. Yeah. On that journey to that big picture…

00:18:56 Tim

Is the fact that the awareness of sign language, of deaf rights, of communication right access, all of that is at different levels, [Alex: mm-hmm] different points in the journey in every country. [Alex: Ohh, absolutely.] It isn't necessarily in the minds, different in the minds of those within the sign language interpreting profession or the deaf community, but in society in general, I think that's where we have all these barriers still.

00:19:28 Alex

Yeah. And that would come to light to me and, and the timeline of things in 2013 where I find myself in Providence, RI, that which would become my CODA school, where I find an ASL class and actually sit in on an ASL class, and it starts to enlighten me [Tim: mm-hmm] in an academic environment to the history and the culture and the things that I was born into and very hyper surrounded by and influenced by, but never really educated in, and it really turned my, my thinking towards, “Wow my upbringing in New England with parents that went to American school for the deaf that was established in 1817” [Tim: mm-hmm] and where it comes from historically. And, and then, “Wait. Then there's this whole oralist camp out there as well too. And like what?! [Tim: laughing] And, and I never thought about that.”

00:20:12 Alex

And in between the 2010 to 2013 Iwas involved in a film project out in the Midwest, where I was exposed to oralist universities and their, and their education systems, [Tim: mm-hmm] and it really made… “What?!” and for me to be so ignorant and to go back to that redheaded girl story is like, how could someone look at me and know more about me than I know about myself?

00:20:36 Tim

Yeah.

00:20:36 Alex

And that really turned me on like, never again. And so, I went on a very, you know, vigilant crusade to, to educate myself about the life that was meant for me and, and I'm still on it to this day and we could take that wherever you'd like.

00:20:50 Tim

Yeah.

00:20:51 Tim

Once you started learning a little bit more about the history, the deaf schools, [Alex: hmm] what was your relationship with your parents like then? Did… how did it change? Did you have more conversations about it or?

00:21:02 Alex

Mass- massively so. So, I was always kinda, sort of brought up… and this is from my dad's perspective and no shade against him, but he's always had a negative perspective even on his own environment or, or place in the world, despite being so highly educated or being so highly exposed to deaf community and relationships and stuff. [Tim: mm-hmm] But it's always been this, and this is probably influencing my “don't be an interpreter”-mindset. [in his dad’s voice] “Don't, don't do deaf stuff. You know there's there's no money in deaf stuff like… You're hearing. Go, go be successful in hearing world”, not verbatim, but I might I would boil it down and distill it in this sort of like, uh, this thing that's kind of been ringing in my mind and finding out about CODA and being involved in this film project in the Midwest and…

00:21:46 Alex

And, and being like, “What?! No, there's some cool stuff here in deaf world.” [Tim: yeah] Despite all my exposure to Timberfest and some [Tim chuckling] great people, just… It was on my own accord at this point in life. And that's where I really picked it up and said, “Thank you dad.”

00:21:59 Alex

So, post film Project coming back home and, and having these sort of like, “Ah. But Dad, what about this?” And, you know, this, the, the, the, the prodigal son returns [Tim chuckles] and sort of like having these discussions.

00:22:10 Alex

It’s always the, the struggle that I have with maybe older generation or maybe a specific type of generation. And I, I don't want to point fingers at anyone or anything, even in my family. But it's this notion of ah, there's more out there than what I've been exposed to, and I want to learn all sides of that. [Tim: hmm]

00:22:30 Alex

And finding this university in Providence, RI with an ASL class and a, and a library filled with deaf culture books that make me sort of open up the historical context of things and enrich, you know, the Milan conference, and, and the dark ages of, of the sign language, the sign language and, and, and, “Oh, what the heck!?”

00:22:47 Alex

And then the linguistic movement in Gallaudet and learning about the, the development of all this stuff and, and the super hyper intellectualization of it in the past, you know, 40-50 years, maybe even less. And it's like, I'm in this right now. I could go either way and I could walk away from it, which and learning about CODA conference and meeting other CODAs both domestically, and internationally, and learning about their awareness and enlightenment. [Tim: mm-hmm]

00:23:11 Alex

I could go one of two ways, and I could imagine there's a lot of CODAs that walk away from it all, despite there being CODA interpreters.

00:23:18 Alex

And I don't know, I just it's a constant struggle that is a lifelong journey. And I've seen many different facets of it from many different people in, along the line, so.

00:23:28 Tim

Yeah. So, your parents went to the American School for the Deaf?

00:23:33 Alex

Yep, in Connecticut.

00:23:34 Tim

Connecticut.

00:23:36 Alex

The first… how do they phrase it? It's not the first school for the Deaf. It's the first permanent one, because I think there was actually a first one, but it, it fell, became defunct.

00:23:44 Tim

Yeah, as you're learning about yourself as a CODA, [Alex: mm-hmm] and realizing what you're experience growing up in this family, what do you think people get wrong about CODAs? Like, if you go back to the lady who came into Starbucks and her awe about you as being a CODA? And then there are people who have a different viewpoint. What is it… What is it about that that is maybe wrong?

00:24:12 Alex

Yeah, the awe… So I feel…

00:24:17 Alex

Like anything, there are many different aspects to anyone thing, so the notion of CODAness is, is a CODA’s journey and everyone's view on it can be XY or Z. [Tim: mm-hmm] I just think it's valuable to be….

[SHORT TRANSITION MUSIC]

[ROCK EXIT MUSIC STARTS]

00:24:35 Tim

Be what? Umm I've done it again, haven't I, stopped in the middle of a sentence? Ah, I could blame the editor, but that would be me. Let's find out what he says next week.

00:24:50 Tim

For now, let's try to pull apart so many deep topics that we've gone over today. First, I really enjoyed just learning about his experience in his life as a CODA and how it intersects a little bit with interpreting, but it allows me to get a different perspective on one piece of the communities that we serve.

00:25:15 Tim

And I'm happy that I learned about deaf Timberfest. Interesting, huh? Axe throwing. Uff. Sounds fun. Well, now back to the topics. Obviously, each CODA experience is individual, but they have many things in common, as we've heard already on the podcast.

00:25:33 Tim

For Alex, his experience, sign language, the communication, everything that happened was a family thing, was that interaction with the family. That's just the way his family was.

00:25:47 Tim

But as he learned more and more what CODA was, what the history of the deaf community was about, oppression about the Milan conference, so many things he realized he wanted more, and he needed to use that language with his own generation.

00:26:07 Tim

He broadened his horizons with the language, the culture, by meeting other CODAs, learning the language on his own, learning the history from someone else, and then tying it back to his family.

00:26:20 Tim

I love the fact that he said in his relationship with interpreters and his family’s relationship with interpreters, how he said there needs to be different relationships between different folks. Each person has to have that relationship in a certain way, and it's different from group to group.

00:26:41 Tim

Seeing that there is a need for interpreters and the interpreter’s relationship with the Deaf is different than with family members.

00:26:50 Tim

But the big topic that we talked abou,t that he said interpreters are just a Band-Aid to the real systemic problem with society and that the system itself needs to correct itself. Yes, there needs to be billable hours, there needs to be evidence of demand for interpreting, to be able to use interpreting, to be able to pay for interpreting, to get funding, to get training, etc.

00:27:16 Tim

But that's part of the symptoms of the problem. Clients having to choose and decide how they want the Band-Aid to look. Does it have a Mickey Mouse on it? Does it have a superhero on it? What does a Band-Aid look like? Which interpreter and how do they use the interpreters, whether it's through video relay or live in person, and that's the client’s choice or it should be.

00:27:44 Tim

But all of that is still part of the symptoms, trying to alleviate the symptoms of society not being able to use the language of this minority group. And so, the simple solution is Sign Language for Humanity. 

It's a great dream, but we see some things happening now in different parts of the world where sign language classes are becoming more mainstream, becoming more of a part of the education system, becoming a, an elective for students to take as a foreign language, degrees in that signed language, recognition of sign language, each of those monumental moments is another step toward Sign Language for Humanity.

00:28:32 Tim

And [sighs] the possibility to get rid of the need for interpreters. What are your thoughts? Is it possible? I think it's possible, whether it's highly probable or only a tiny bit probable that is where we are.

00:28:52 Tim

Well, until next time, keep calm, keep interpreting the symptoms. I'll see you next week. Take care now.

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